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Phuket's Army Cleanup Chief Calls in Reinforcements: First Beaches, Then Corruption
By Chutima Sidasathian Wednesday, July 23, 2014
PHUKET: Thailand's Army needs YOU, 6000 students have been told, and Phuket's pupils will be turning out in their thousands to thoroughly clean all of the holiday island's popular west coast beaches this Sunday.
The Army's most senior officer on Phuket, Major General Somchai Ponatong, was keen to make the point today to Phuketwan that Sunday's huge Phuket beaches cleanup is not the only Phuket cleanup.
''We are looking at the effort being applied by all Phuket officials and police,'' he said.
''If we sense that some are not performing their duties properly, we will call those people in to the Royal Thai Navy base at Cape Panwa and carefully explain to them where their duties should be and how they should carry out their duties.''
With the remarkable clearances on Phuket's famous beaches still going on, the services of Army cadets at Phuket's schools are being called on for what could prove to be one of the most important Phuket cleanup days so far.
The boys and a lesser number of girls will start their cleanup campaign at Sai Kaew beach, the northernmost of Phuket's beaches.
All the other well-known beaches are listed: Mai Khao, Nai Yang, Nai Thon, Layan, Laypang, Bang Tao, Surin Laem Singh, Kamala, Patong, Karon, Kata, Kata Noi, Ya Nui and Nai Harn.
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Comments
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How long the National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO) will play the "Mouse & Cat" game before its starts to indict civil servants for "Negligence on Duty" and remove them from the Thai Administration?
Posted by
Whistle-Blower
on
July 23, 2014 14:55
The problem is when high season comes. It's going to take a huge and sustained effort to stop things back-sliding.
I'm sure a lot of people think it's just a matter of waiting the army out and it will be back to business as usual.
Then we must wait and see if Phuket can attract back the people it's lost as regulars. Whilst I applaud the effort to fix things up, for a lot of people I know it's too little too late.
The greedy minority have ruined it for everybody in terms of the beach businesses. I warned everybody on Surin beach years ago, if one person paid to use the beach privately everybody would want the same deal.
Still haven't seen one arrest of officials who allowed this to happen.
Posted by
Arun Muruga
on
July 23, 2014 15:02
no hope.. I was back a minivan just 5 minutes ago.. from the window came out a small plastic bag full of garbage stright to the jungle on the side. I horned to him, but the driver just didn't care...
Posted by
dave
on
July 23, 2014 15:19
Great to get young people involved in the clean up , another great outing would be to the dump to see the waste we create. get young people involved in the 3-R's and the pile would drop over time.
Posted by
Leigh
on
July 23, 2014 15:19
Hope Mr. Whistle-Blower is going to help cleaning up the beaches
Posted by
wm
on
July 23, 2014 15:25
wm - even voluntary work by foreigners needs a work permit. Given that tea money is drying up at the moment WB wouldn't last 5 minutes without being lifted.
Posted by
Mister Ree
on
July 23, 2014 16:07
Why not drag the drug dealers,corrupt criminals scam artists , beach vendors and taxi drivers from the jail and use them to clean the beachs up along with those officials who made the mess . The kids are being used yet again when the fat cats who approved and made money on the back of these beach businesses sit back in their air conditioned office with not a care in the world the children on this island are more than aware of the need for responsibility regarding their environment sir it is those that have caused the mess and made money that should be forced to clean this mess up not the fine youngsters of this island .
Posted by
Scunner
on
July 23, 2014 16:39
Getting people involved en masse in cleaning up the beaches may make them think twice before they throw garbage everywhere.
Then again, maybe not but it's worth a shot.
Every day one can see people throwing garbage from cars, motorbikes and while walking. It's like nobody gives a damn, yet when asked, they'll all claim they Love Thailand.
Hypocrites.
Posted by
ThaiMike
on
July 23, 2014 20:24
Editor Comment:
Total rubbish, ThaiMike. Literally.
There are people in Thailand who care and people who don't. It's the same everywhere. Spare us the warped pontifications, please.
It most definitely is not the same everywhere.
That is the typical, local excuse for everything that's wrong here.
Try tossing a bag of garbage out of a car window in any civilized nation and see what happens if caught.
Posted by
ThaiMike
on
July 23, 2014 21:29
Editor Comment:
Throwing litter from a moving car has nothing to do with whether a country is ''civilised,'' ThaiMike, and that's where your bleat blows in the wind. Education campaigns are what made Westerners stop littering. If many thought they could get away with it, they'd still be doing it. Try logic not put-downs, please.
I see Rawai is sadly missing. It's a good effort, raises awareness and educates the kids. I don't want to poo poo it, but the beaches will be covered in garbage again within 24-48 hours with these winds. What we need is a couple of full time beach cleaners on each beach. SEEK (Society, Environment, Economy, Knowledge) has done this on a few beaches already with their Green Club initiatives. Patong, Kata, Karon, Nai Harn, etc still need Green Clubs.
Posted by
NomadJoe
on
July 23, 2014 22:58
I understand your point but I disagree.
Logic would tell us it's education that has made countries civilized.
I'm sorry but I'm just not buying the excuse that people somehow do not know littering is bad. IMO many simply just don't give a damn.
Trying to educate ignorance and indifference out of people is not likely to be very successful.
Mai Pen Rai is a distinct Thai characteristic and I strongly feel that mentality is the root cause of this somewhat trivial problem when looking at the big picture.
Posted by
ThaiMike
on
July 23, 2014 23:04
Editor Comment:
Traditionally, Thai takeaway was served in organically disposable banana leaves and coconut shells. So, because people have had less time to adjust to non-disposable Western replacements, some still imagine it's possible to throw stuff out the window without concern. Who is to blame for the step backwards from the traditional to the profit-making? Why, the ''civilised'' inventors and producers of non-disposable packaging. Did ''civilised'' people have to be taught how to live with this new monster? Of course.
Since the Prison is so over crowded, it would probably benefit them if they were involved with the clean up.
Get them some exercise, some niceties can go a long way.
They have nothing else to do apart from get diseases and malnutrition while rotting in an overcrowded room.
Posted by
Tbs
on
July 23, 2014 23:10
The Banana leaf excuse is valid, but certainly not in countries like Thailand.
Having visited several small pacific island nations, I accept that over there it is indeed often the root cause for the surprising amount of trash being thrown around but Thailand is worlds apart from that.
Non-organic food packaging has been around in Thailand for at least 2 generations. Nobody below the age of 50 could possibly use that as an excuse and even those above that age have had decades to adjust.
Have you ever tried to confront a Thai who just threw garbage out, or worse, right in front of your house ?
I did and it did not go well. More garbage kept turning up.
1. They did not give a damn
2. Being asked not to do it caused loss of face and thus in a typical childish local response they added up the ante instead of stopping it because backtracking would have equaled admitting having been wrong.
3. Throwing garbage into someone's yard is a sign of total disrespect and they were all too keen to make sure the farang feels it in his bones. I did.
There are so many problems in and around Thailand that can be directly attributed to far too many people just not giving a damn.
If you can keep a more positive spin on such issues than I can, good for you.
Posted by
ThaiMike
on
July 24, 2014 08:02
Editor Comment:
I live in a suburb where garbage is efficiently collected every day of the week and I know of Thai restaurants nearby where garbage is carefully sorted for recycling. I also visit rural Thailand from time to time. While there are some places where rubbish is thoughtlessly dumped, the generalisations you seem determined to push ( ''they'' did not give a damn, ''typically childish local response,'' make sure the''farang feels it in his bones'' ) are bigotry at its worst. Shameful stuff.Your grasp of everything around you lacks balance and tolerance. There is nothing Thai about you, Mike, sad to say.
Developing countries forced to adopt new ideas, (whether for example needless packaging, alcohol or cigarettes) are often left to live with the consequences. The problem is the developed countries' profit-takers don't meet their obligations to behave responsibly.
Gee I really do wish the Junta would start looking into the non advise and non delivery from Thalang Post Office? Items that used to take two to three days to get me are now taking 16 to 21 days. I don't get advise when the item has arrived, items go missing and I end up going to the post office myself to find things that are not delivered.
Thank heavens I do not have the same sh-- with the courier services. Three days at the most from the US, one day from Bangkok to Phuket.
This service has gone down the toilet.
Thank you if you can fix this, General in charge Phuket.
Posted by
Graham
on
July 24, 2014 08:14
Editor Comment:
Have you tried asking the Post Office what the problem is?
Littering is just laziness pure and simple!Thai or Farang.Phuket needs more garbage stations allowing for people to leave there rubbish, thus maybe creating a few more jobs for people to. IMO you only need to see the state at which these Thai beach vendors have left there piece of paradise after being kicked out to understand most don't really care. Education and policing will make a difference, 500 baht on the spot (ticket with receipt) fine for littering, make people responsible for there actions, that's what seems to be lacking. See you all on sunday :-)
Posted by
Anonymous
on
July 24, 2014 10:25
@ ED. Yes the answer from Thalang post office, " We cannot get good staff, they run away from work and won't deliver in big estates'" Smile smile smile.
Answer from Bangkok, " Thalang has a staff problem with theft and workers who don't know the area and who just leave after a few days."
End of matter, have a problem and nobody can sort it out.
Can somebody sort it out please?
Posted by
Graham
on
July 24, 2014 10:51
@ThaiMike You're very wrong to say education programs don't work. I saw an episode of Mad Men (set in the 50's/60's), whereby a family on a picnic merely picked up and shook the picnic blanket leaving trash all over the grass and left! I remember many public education tv ads in the UK years ago. The crying Native American struck biggest chord with me. Perhaps they should show a crying Thai watching his beloved country being despoiled.
Posted by
jonty
on
July 24, 2014 11:36
Re Thalang Post-Office: I recently ordered a custom-made metal bracket from a US supplier. The item was delivered by EMS to Thalang Post Office for payment of a small import tax. Problem was that Thalang couldn't be bothered to actually contact me to come and pay that tax. So after 1 month, that expensive ($100) bracket was returned to the sender as undeliverable.
When I confronted them about this, they made the same excuse about unreliable staff.
And about my bracket? 'Oh, you will have to pay the EMS charge again to have it sent here'.
Pathetic!
Posted by
Simon Luttrell
on
July 24, 2014 11:44
Re: Thalang Post Office
The labour market is overheated, in part of labour-intensive jobs.
For Thailand economy if would be ultimately good thing if according adjustment would take a place, and that could happen both on supply side (ASEAN workers could get home as economic conditions eg in Burma are improving ), and on demand side(fishing industry contracting as it could become uncompetitive if proper labour standards are followed; decrease of tourist number (sunbed lovers) etc.),
so that there would be all time UNEMPLOYMENT of say ca.5%(vs.1% now),
that would provide for COMPETITION at labour market that is sorely lacking now, thus labour marker is the one of "seller", i.e.of employee, and employees have in general low incentives to improve performance, this one being a major factor (and other one wide corruption that kills meritocracy ).
Posted by
Sue
on
July 24, 2014 12:46
It is all about education. When I was younger litter was normal in Sydney. Still is in some areas. Education takes a generation but needs to start somewhere. When on a few islands off Phuket in December we found ourselves pulling rubbish from the water and the shoreline by habit. Some people instinctively joined us, some looked at us like we were weird. And not many were Thai, most were from various countries. Most of the litter came from tourists, not locals, there was not many locals there but plenty of tourists. Education is needed for tourists as well. Thai's need to be more proactive in asking tourists to protect their beautiful country.
Posted by
Davemc60
on
July 24, 2014 13:10
I tend to side with ThaiMike's view on littering in this country. Sure there are local people conscious of the slovenliness of some of their fellow compatriots when it comes to trashing the place, but these individuals are most definitely in a minority. And certainly litterbugs are a global phenomenon. But here we're talking about the country where we happen to live.
I vividly recall when I was teaching at a Thai provincial university over thirty years ago (not that long after plastic bag usage had began to increase radically largely replacing baskets, banana leaves and so on). I had a lovely class of trainee teachers who were not adverse to thoughtlessly chucking stuff all over the campus though not in their own personal space (of the countless homes I have visited over many years - from the extremely poor to those of more substantial means - the interiors were, vitually without exception, immaculately kept - outside, beyong the perimeter - well that's generally somebody else's concern). Anyway I was appalled by this behaviour of many of my students (teachers of the future) and tried illustrating, by somewhat dramatic means, what they were actually doing. I drew I picture of a house (their house), and then someone getting up on their bed and defaecating on it, and said this, is essentially what you're doing to your country. Apart from a little twittering in response (the 20th century version of this naturally), all I got were simply blank, almost incomprehending, looks (I had also explained this in very polite Thai for those in my class whose English was a little below par). We went on and talked about the issue and then as now, for all too many, it was seen as somebody else's responsibilty (sadly, paternalism runs deep in this country). Even so I continue to live in hope.
Posted by
Kaen Phet
on
July 24, 2014 14:00
Editor Comment:
Has there been an anti-litter campaign of the kind run from time to time in developed countries? If so, I missed it. Until public and peer pressure is there, and it's upfront and obvious, well-meaning lectures will remain just that. At the same time, more Thais are aware of the need and a substantial number are already on board. In terms of priorities, though, littering has a high priority in countries where every other significant issue has been dealt with. Litter rightly doesn't rank anywhere near the top in places where life and death issues deservedly take priority.
When I first came to stay long term on Phuket 30 years ago it was considered the safest province with the most honest people.
Phuket today is full of transients, many of the people who work and live there have allegiances to other areas and only see Phuket as a place to earn money.
Many of the families in Patong who claim to be Phuket people are not originally from Phuket. They are from the Northeast and migrated to work as labourers in the rice paddies of Patong.
People forget Patong was all rice paddy fields not so long ago. The family who run all the jet skis and para sailing are originally from Isarn not Patong.
Posted by
Arun Muruga
on
July 24, 2014 14:14
Arun - as I recall it (from 1975) Karon had a lot more 'rice paddies' than Patong. Indeed, nearly all of the flat part of Karon except for the area around the southern end was, I'm sure you'll recall, all rice fields with nary a tree in sight. A rather barren place in fact. But your point taken. It was once an incredibly friendly, welcoming island with seemingly hardly any people (especially around the beaches save for some mainly fishing families) compared with nowadays. From the late 80s onwards Thais from all over the country started coming here in increasing numbers - prior to that it seemed to be mainly other southerners (from Surat, Nakorn, Songkla, etc.) in addition to the local Phuket inhabitants.
Posted by
kaen Phet
on
July 24, 2014 14:55
Re Littering
There is a problem with littering here, but only compared to a very small number of developed countries like Japan or the Scandinavian countries for example. Italy for example, a supposedly 'civilised and developed country' is far FAR worse than Thailand. And no, I'm not talking about the complete disgrace that is Naples, travel along any major autostrada and you will be shocked at the amount of garbage.
Posted by
christian
on
July 24, 2014 16:35
I have some video tapes with many hours I shot on Phuket in 1987 just as all the big developments started. Haven't even looked at it as it is on the original small tapes and I have nothing to play them on anymore.
Posted by
Arun Muruga
on
July 24, 2014 16:42
- Ed
It was a bunch of young Thai men (thus "they" ) getting drunk every day who happened to live across the street from me up on 50 Pee Rd in Patong. From their elevated position they thought it was very funny to keep throwing garbage into my yard.
Strangely enough none ever landed in my Thai neighbors yard which was equally in range.
The things they said to me about Farangs etc could not be reprinted here but it's gracious of you to blame it all on me anyway.
The fact that you feel the need to resort to such offensive remarks says a lot more about you than it does about me.
You are right about 1 thing though. Except for my location, there's definitely no "Thainess" in me. If it was not for my financial liabilities wgich just got worse because of the coup, I'd be long gone.
- Graham
That was UK. Never heard of Mai Pen Rai in the UK. I did not say education does not work. I said it's almost pointless against ignorance and indifference, with which this country is blessed with to a degree several times that of any other nation I can think of.
Posted by
Non-ThaiMike
on
July 24, 2014 17:48
Editor Comment:
There you go again. Do you think neighbors live happily together everywhere else in the world except Thailand? It would be a mistake to assume that Patong is anything like the rest of Thailand, or that because the local boyos throw garbage into your yard, people all over the country litter in the same fashion. Patong seems to be your problem.
- Ed
You really love to twist everything someone says to suit your prejudices.
Nowhere did I say my opinion about the garbage issue in Thailand is based on this incident.
I've been living here for over 10y, have traveled extensively all over this country in my car and left Patong eons ago (8y ago).
I'm also quite fluent in Thai, which reduces chances of misunderstandings due to language barriers.
I can see examples of what I said here earlier every day I venture out, even just around Chalong where I live.
My opinions are based on my experiences and just because they may be different from yours does not mean they are flawed.
Contrary to your belief, you do not have a divine monopoly for The Absolute Truth.
Try letting people express their opinions without inserting snide, patronizing and condescending remarks and baseless assumptions when they do not share your POV.
Posted by
Non-ThaiMike
on
July 24, 2014 20:55
Editor Comment:
I don't have any prejudices, Non-ThaiMike, you just assume everybody else is like you.
''Contrary to your belief, you do not have a divine monopoly for The Absolute Truth.'' Not a belief of mine, but perhaps another of your prejudices.
''Try letting people express their opinions without inserting snide, patronizing and condescending remarks and baseless assumptions when they do not share your POV''.
Entirely your interpretation. Nothing we say is ''snide, patronizing or condescending,'' except in your imagination.
The alternative: think before you continue to denigrate Thais and Thailand. Try to get some balance and tolerance in your views on life.
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How long the National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO) will play the "Mouse & Cat" game before its starts to indict civil servants for "Negligence on Duty" and remove them from the Thai Administration?
Posted by Whistle-Blower on July 23, 2014 14:55